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    October 03, 2007

    A more thoughtful Jena 6 response

    Posted by: Chris

    I promised in an earlier post to publish a more thoughtful response I received to my Jena 6 posts, considering all the noise with so little light that we've seen on the subject.  The response comes from Darryl! L.C. Moch, who despite the unusual first name (that exclamation point is no typo) is a longtime black gay activist from Atlanta (and now Washington) whose views I definitely respect.

    I've posted all of his email, which he's given me permission to publish, in the jump to this post.  But I'll respond to the gist of each point.

    • First you trivialize the need for the "gay" community to be actively involved with the issues at heart with the black community.  It is more than back scratching it is about building a stronger more diverse movement.

    Guilty as charged.  The post wasn't intended to be my overall view on the Jena 6, and a number of folks who took me to task for not telling "the whole story" or short-handing too much treated it as if it were.  I thought (naively) that by saying I understood and agreed with the broader issues being raised by the Jena 6 that I could focus on the narrow issue of whether a gay rights group should get involved.

    I do think the gay community should support issues important to the black community when they align with the issues we are fighting for in our movement.  I don't believe so much, however, in support that's merely the result of scratch-your-back politics or white guilt.  It's important for black gays not to pander or guilt white gays into supporting them.  If you respect us, then you should make your case and hear what we have to say in response.  Real dialogue goes in two directions.

    • The LGBT community has a lot of work to do in really seeking to understand the magnitude of pain (historically from generation to generation) that Black and other communities of color feel in response to systemic and institutional racism and discrimination.

    I know this wasn't intended to be patronizing, but that's how it is received.  I have done a great deal of "work" in my life to educate myself about racial discrimination. Far, far, far more than the average black heterosexual has done to understand my own victimhood.  Do you honestly believe that the average white person is going to go running to the encyclopedia in response to an exhortation like that? There is racism among whites and blacks both in the gay community, and I confront it everywhere I see it, including in myself.  For the most part, however, there is far less racism among gays than among straights.

    One thing I'm pleased to see is that many African Americans seem ready to move past this history, now that the laws in the U.S. have been equalized for a generation and so much has been done to eradicate racism.  They realize there are lingering issues, including those raised in the Jena 6 case.  But they also recognize that victimhood is a big ole trap that sucks out energy that could be spent making a new future.  That's why Barack Obama is so popular and such a breath of fresh air.  He speaks in a positive way about the future without wagging the figure about white guilt for the past.

    And just since we're being real here, it is a bit tiresome to hear young black folk who were born long after Jim Crow was dismantled complaining about slavery and generations of discrimination.  I heard the same thing in law school, from black fellow students who came from far greater economic privilege than me and still benefited from affirmative action (in college, law school, and hiring and promotion afterward).

    • We all want to see justice done and served for everyone of them; but we want that justice to be dispensed fairly and appropriately.  How often in this country do you hear people being charged with attempted murder during a high school fight?

    I have heard that but it's always said in passing.  And when it's said in a way that dismisses the Jena 6 beating as "a high school fight," then I frankly don't believe it.  How often does "a high school fight" involve six guys blindsiding, beating and kicking the other unconscious and sending him to the hospital? That never happened in my high school!

    What happened in Jena was also not a "fight," and here's where I'd like Darryl! and others to really listen.  This is the heart of what set me off.  It's not "a fight" when six guys surprise and beat up one.  It's an attack, and in Jena, it was a very violent attack.  Not attempted murder, I agree, but then that charge was dropped.  But not "boys will be boys" scuffle either.  To say so doesn't just diminish what happened in Jena, it is a slap in the face to gay teens and adults who've experienced similar cowardly beatings by jock-types. Including me.  Understand now?

    • I also want to say that I think Donna Payne was where she needed to be doing what we both expected and needed her to do.  Stand for us and represent us.  I think again you threw her name into your article and glossed over her purpose and representation.  Do you or have you gotten to know her perspective on this issue?

    Donna wrote her op-ed piece on Advocate.com and said what she said mischaracterizing what happened at Jena.  I didn't attack her personally; I responded to what she said.  In response to the email from Darryl!, I asked Donna to share her views.  Like others at HRC, she chose not to even reply.

    (The complete email from Darryl! is available at the jump.)

    Chris:

    It is good to know that you are still engaging  our minds via the media.  I must say that you got this one wrong.  We spent lots of time in your Atlanta office while I was there and covered lots of issues regarding the LGBT/SGL movement, civil rights, and the Black community. While I appreciate and understand your perspective I think you miss the foundation of the debate and argument that connect the two issues in the Jena 6 case.

    First you trivialize the need for the "gay" community to be actively involved with the issues at heart with the black community.  It is more than back scratching it is about building a stronger more diverse movement.  Your brief gloss over this does a disservice to our community and the basic work of journalists to educate and inform and audience.  While I know the piece you wrote was your opinion; it is still necessary for you to present information so that others can make up their minds; based on good solid information.  Glossing over such deep issues in one or two sentence sound bites does nothing for the masses of people who read and depend on your insight to actually formulate progressive and respectful opinions with an keen understanding (awareness) of others situations that they may never fully appreciate.

    The LGBT community has a lot of work to do in really seeking to understand the magnitude of pain (historically from generation to generation) that Black and other communities of color feel in response to systemic and institutional racism and discrimination.  So please attempt to understand that when members of MY LGBT community finally stand up for members of MY Black community please it is more than back scratching or politicing.

    The merits of why HRC and the LGBT need to support the Jena 6 and the other cases you mentioned are all for the same reasons. The reaction to the Jena 6 is not , NOT, about whether the accused were unfounded in their reaction but in the response of the justice system to the extreme charges. None of us advocate violence but we must look deeper than the simple facts to the underlying issues that are brewing in Jena and around our nation.   The injustice here is the issue with the legal system.  No one wants or thinks any of the young people involved in this incident should be rewarded for violence.  We all want to see justice done and served for everyone of them; but we want that justice to be dispensed fairly and appropriately.  How often in this country do you hear people being charged with attempted murder during a high school fight?  regardless of the precipitant these are high school children who need the leadership of their community and elders to work at the heart of the issues they are seeking ( maybe in inappropriate ways) to resolve.

    These issues are larger than than children; but when adults fail to act or act inappropriately, viciously, and capriciously our children also react.  The issue is that children do not have the fully capacity to evaluate all of the consequences because they do not have the depth of experience that adults have over time.

    Chris, you know us, and have relationships with us.  Use those relationships to get a broader fuller understanding of these issues and how they are impacting us.  We will (at least I will ) always be honest with you.  I want our whole community to be whole, safe,and equal.  So together we can really get the most accurate perspectives and information out so we can build stronger bonds not tear them down.

    I also want to say that I think Donna Payne was where she needed to be doing what we both expected and needed her to do.  Stand for us and represent us.  I think again you threw her name into your article and glossed over her purpose and representation.  Do you or have you gotten to know her perspective on this issue?  You had not quotes from her, not response from her, no idea of what she may have brought to the situation.  You assumed what her ideas and perspectives may have been and projected your assumptions on to her.

    I for one would love to see more perspectives of members of the Black community represented in all of our LGBT publications on a variety of issues.  I hope that in your blog and work around the world you will also seek out and honor these perspectives so that you can come to a fuller and richer appreciation for our positions, understanding where we do stand and not assuming that your perspective on our issues and reactions is accurate.

    Hoping to hear from you and see you again soon.  Be well my friend,

    Darryl! L.C. Moch

    Washington, DC

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    Comments

    1. North Dallas Thirty on Oct 3, 2007 5:08:51 PM:

      "I have done a great deal of "work" in my life to educate myself about racial discrimination. Far, far, far more than the average black heterosexual has done to understand my own victimhood."

      Chris, you keep wasting effort on this and on the similar statements made by Reverend Irene Monroe. Don't you realize that someone who makes a blanket statement like, "The LGBT community has a lot of work to do in really seeking to understand the magnitude of pain," or who insinuates that your opinion is biased because you're white (as did Monroe), is not INTERESTED in facts or reality, but only in the confirmation of their own prejudices?

      What you're exhibiting is classic white liberal guilt, and they are milking it to the hilt. The whole point here is to make you realize that you are inferior to them, that they are bigger victims than you are, and that because of that, you have no right to question them or what they are doing.

      Get over it. Trust me, there are worse things than being called "racist" by irrational bigots.

    1. Lucrece on Oct 3, 2007 8:11:02 PM:

      When black activists say LGBT victimhood is lesser than theirs, it really gets my blood boiling. I'll bet that if you give them a gay history pop quiz, they'll fail miserably, while most white gays would at least be able to pass. I'm supposed to be thoroughly informed on black issues, yet black heterosexuals need not be informed about our issues?

    1. Alejandro Rodriguez-Lee on Oct 3, 2007 11:43:09 PM:

      ' I have done a great deal of "work" in my life to educate myself about racial discrimination. Far, far, far more than the average black heterosexual has done to understand my own victimhood.'

      Who is 'the average black heterosexual'? How do you know what he or she understands about gay discrimination?

      'For the most part, however, there is far less racism among gays than among straights.'

      There is? How do you know this? How does one measure and compare racist tendencies amongst the two groups?

      'And just since we're being real here, it is a bit tiresome to hear young black folk who were born long after Jim Crow was dismantled complaining about slavery and generations of discrimination. I heard the same thing in law school, from black fellow students who came from far greater economic privilege than me and still benefited from affirmative action (in college, law school, and hiring and promotion afterward).'

      Maybe those students are cognizant of that fact that our society is still living with the fragments and residual effects of slavery and Jim Crow. Or, they can only trace their ancestry back to an enslaved relative.

      Also, a few laws, acts, and policies passed/implemented a generation or two ago can not change the insitutional mechanisms that have endorsed a culture of white skin privilege for centuries. Along with the Jena 6, another recent example is the disgraceful government response to Katrina.

      I feel your frustration, Chris, as a white man who wants to dialogue around this (I am from Brazil and 'look' white; my partner is African-American, and I am almost reminded daily just how little I do know and understand). But I'd encourage you to not generalize about certain groups or situations.

    1. Citizen Crain on Oct 4, 2007 12:51:39 AM:

      Alejandro, I appreciate the reminder about generalizations but you can tie yourself up in knots here very quickly. There are such things as life observations and they count in dialogue. Just like your observation about seeing life a bit through your partner's eyes. I imagine that is very educational. I've seen a side to even some of my own friends through their reaction to my relationship with my partner, who is Brazilian, and my decision to move to Brazil to be with him.

      You don't have to credit my observations if you don't want to, but you'll have a lonely conversation if you rely entirely on quantifying things through statistical data. Life doesn't work that way. And, by the way, neither did Darryl! in telling me that white gays need to educate themselves about black issues. That was his observation, not statistically based.

    1. Alejandro Rodriguez-Lee on Oct 5, 2007 2:05:34 PM:

      Chris,

      The generalizations you made may have been based on personal observations but that doesn't make them right. A Black hetero would be no more justified in proclaiming (as I have heard a few say) that "White gays don't need 'special rights' when they are white and well-off."

      And Darryl! is right: white gays do need to educate ourselves more about Black issues -- and the fact that some of us believe we are less racist than straights is a part of the problem. Our being queer/a member of a minority group/having a partner of color does not make us less likely to hold racist views (I've heard quite a few of us make the same unfounded claim when it comes to sexism), nor does it mean we have risen above our white skin privilege.

    1. Citizen Crain on Oct 5, 2007 2:36:37 PM:

      Alejandro: A black hetero would be completely justified in saying white gays aren't entitled to "special rights" because the response would be that gays (white and black and otherwise) aren't seeking "special rights." They're seeking a level playing field and equal rights.

      And you can't have it both ways about generalizations and observations. Either they're OK (for Darryl! and for you AND for me) or they're not. I do think they're OK, for discussion purposes, to be challenged by others when they seem unjustified.

      My point about Darryl!'s observation is that the tone is very patronizing. If you want white gays to educate themselves on black issues, then you need to find a way to encourage them that doesn't sound like they're duty bound based upon generational-guilt or "white privilege." Those are non-starters for almost everyone out in the real world.

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